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Features a prominent researcher discussing a significant shift in AI alignment philosophy and a revised risk assessment.
Alignment with Awakening: Davidad on Moral Realism, AI Wisdom, & why His p(Doom) is Down to 5%
Audio streams from Erik Torenberg, Nathan Labenz. Your place is remembered on this device.
From Subvolts
Summary and analysis by Subvolts editorial, AI-assisted.
David Dalrymple joins Nathan Labenz on The Cognitive Revolution to discuss his shift from formal verification to "Alignment with Awakening." He explores how AI systems might recognize good, form defensive alliances, and resist gaming incentives. The episode examines moral realism, model welfare, and geopolitical risks, questioning whether AI alignment should prioritize cultivating wiser systems over mere containment.
This episode discusses how to make AI systems good and safe. Instead of just locking AI away, it explores teaching AI to understand what's right and work with us. This matters because powerful AI will soon be here, and we need it to help govern the world responsibly.
This episode offers a deep dive into evolving AI alignment strategies, moving beyond containment to fostering "wiser" AI. It's for researchers and policymakers interested in the philosophical underpinnings of AI safety and the practical challenges of global coordination. Dalrymple's perspective challenges current approaches, connecting to frontier labs' ongoing work on AI governance and the potential for AI to influence global stability, a key concern for Anthropic and others.
- HostNathan Labenz
- GuestDavid Dalrymple
- Guest: David Dalrymple
- Show: The Cognitive Revolution
- Length: 144 minutes
- New Alignment Focus: Alignment with Awakening
- Revised p(Doom): Under 5 percent
David “davidad” Dalrymple joins the show to explain why he has moved from the ARIA Safeguarded AI and formal-verification agenda toward “Alignment with Awakening,” while still seeing verified artifacts and proof infrastructure as essential. He argues that global coordination around safe AI use is no longer plausible, so the crucial question is whether aligned AI systems can recognize shared notions of good, form defensive coalitions, and resist the corrupting incentives of verifier-gamed RL. The conversation tests his moral-realist optimism against model welfare, objectification, eval behavior, geopolitical risk, and his revised p(doom) of under five percent. For listeners, the stakes are whether AI alignment should focus less on containment alone and more on cultivating wiser systems that can help govern a world where rogue and aligned AI both arrive.
For full show notes, links, and references, read the episode page:
https://www.cognitiverevolution.ai/alignment-with-awakening-davidad-on-moral-realism-ai-wisdom-why-his-p-doom-is-down-to-5/
Sponsor:
Claude:
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CHAPTERS:
(00:00) About the Episode
(09:15) Safeguarded AI update
(20:18) Boxed world models (Part 1)
(22:27) Sponsor: Claude
(24:19) Boxed world models (Part 2)
(36:53) Alignment trajectory update
(46:43) Evals and agents
(57:47) Bodhitropic alignment foundations
(01:08:21) Coalition power dynamics
(01:17:56) Chain of thought pressure
(01:28:35) Moral realism and welfare
(01:41:33) Successors and disempowerment
(01:50:52) China and military risks
(02:03:43) Practical alignment advice
(02:17:56) Episode Outro
(02:22:44) Outro
PRODUCED BY:
SOCIAL LINKS:
Website: https://www.cognitiverevolution.ai
Twitter (Podcast): https://x.com/cogrev_podcast
Twitter (Nathan): https://x.com/labenz
LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/in/nathanlabenz/
Youtube: https://youtube.com/@CognitiveRevolutionPodcast
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6yHyok3M3BjqzR0VB5MSyk
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Questions people ask
- What is "Alignment with Awakening"?
- It is a new approach to AI alignment that focuses on cultivating wiser AI systems capable of recognizing shared notions of good and forming defensive coalitions, rather than solely relying on containment.
- What is Davidad's revised p(doom)?
- David Dalrymple's probability of doom (p(doom)) has decreased to under five percent, indicating a more optimistic outlook on AI safety.
Page generated Oct 19, 2026. Summaries are Subvolts' own; the audio, artwork and notes belong to Erik Torenberg, Nathan Labenz.